Video DJ's ... The Silence is deafening

I'm starting to believe that the majority of Video DJ's are following Cap's lead and doing the "fight club thing".. We dont talk about video DJing, we don't admit to being Video DJ's, we dont share information about VDJing.. (not blaming cap LOL, he was just the first person who outright said it.. )

I just thought it was here, but now that I have joined a few facebook groups, and sometimes check out other forums,
the same old dead horses are still being brought up (not so much here, but other groups), the same old "raise the bar" arguments, etc etc

I see more conversations about photobooths, then VDJing! LOL

I'm just starting to wonder if for the first time our industry decided, 'frack it, we are keeping this internal.. no sharing, no books, no websites about it'

OR, could it still be that not enough guys are doing it? (which doesnt make sense to me, as I know they are out there, I'm just not seeing the corresponding 'talking' about it)

I've had videos available to clients since 2004 but few have taken advantage of the offering. Oh yeah they'd love to have it BUT they want it at the same price as audio DJ'ing. I don't think they realize that it requires additional gear and setup time, higher powered front-end gear, a video library and the like. I've given it away a couple of time for S&G's just to get it out there and it's drawn lots of attention until you discuss the additional costs.

Personally I love doing it especially since I also use my Sony live 'JamCam" to put real people up on the screens, get to run slide shows etc BUT ..... in my market here in Maryland, the only demand has been from high schools at their biggest events being Homecomings and Proms.

Hip,

Here's my view on it. My observation is that for the most part, Video DJing is a bar/club thing, while the Wedding/Mobile market is not. At most weddings, many people don't want to compete with the music to have a good time talking with people (some of which they only see at weddings & funerals), even less so, video.

I know people are out there doing it, I just think it's a hard sell for many mobile gigs. I could be wrong.

The other thing is this...My experience is that the priority of people who may want video is: sound, dancers, and lighting, then video. With my pricing structure, many are tapped out by the time they get to lighting upgrades (usually Sweet 16s & Mitzvahs). I've sold more "Video" showcasing it's capabilities to capture and display the live action on the dance floor (via HD remote "Robo-cams") than by displaying Music Videos. It's kinda funny, the 15 to 17 year olds simply love to watch themselves dance on the 1 or 2 big screens. It's like visual cocaine or something, they simply can't get enough of it. -Z-

I do a lot of it at Sweet 16s, at least 20 a year I'd say.

The reason VJing isn't popular, irrespective of all the other reasoning, is that there is a huge time investment in finding materials, a huge time investment in learning editing and playback software, a large monetary investment in editing software, a large investment in monitors and mounting hardware, a need for larger space in transport and handling, and so forth. Big, large, huge in terms of time and money equals limited entry.

When and if there becomes a greater demand on the smaller scale of events, trust that "everything anyone ever wanted to know about VJing" will become common place. I'm in no hurry to spur the demand nor dilute my current market share.

Most of the guys I know do use video. There's tons of video DJ discussion on the facebook groups, but as you pointed out, a lot of it is being kept out of the public eye. Finally, where forums were restrictive because everyone watching could steal ideas and run, Facebook allows us to have a closed group with trusted members, share and discuss openly and freely, and shut everyone else out. It seems DJ Information Sharing has become to facebook what Mobile Beat was to the web before the onset of the cobwebs. Everyone who used to be here is now there. That being said, that's the catch all bin. All the good stuff happens in all the closed micro groups. Most of us enjoy the ability to simply punt someone who doesn't fit in.

Search around for some of the VJ groups. Many are invite only, and often oriented towards a certain software, However, I'm in a couple with world famous VJs who I'm in nowhere the same league as. It's also nice to be able to request a file, or help someone out without the crybabies chiming in about legality, or fairness, or whatever. Those are the people we keep out.

The group is the moderator, the democratic dynamic makes for far greater participation than rule by a few disaffected mods.

Steve Lynch said:

Most of the guys I know do use video. There's tons of video DJ discussion on the facebook groups, but as you pointed out, a lot of it is being kept out of the public eye.

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To be honest I havent done a concerted effort at trying to find dedicated Video DJ groups.. I guess I better do that
The actual "VDJ/atomix" groups, they talk about video dj, but it seems kinda lacking there also.. more conversations about speakers and hardware then the 'act' itself LOL

Cap said:

The reason VJing isn't popular,

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I also wouldnt say its "popular"
but, my incidental evidence (from local DJs , and websites of DJs), says that at least 10% of DJ's are taking a run at it..
but I am not seeing the corresponding "talk", "*****ing", and "discussion" about it..

IE: when uplighting and photobooths first started gaining traction, I saw people talking about all over the place.. VDJ, is the complete opposite of what I have seen in the past for upcoming technologies/ideas..

I'm not 'really' complaining.. I just think its kinda weird? its not following the same pattern.

DJSTEVEZ said:

Hip, Here's my view on it. My observation is that for the most part, Video DJing is a bar/club thing, while the Wedding/Mobile market is not. At most weddings, many people don't want to compete with the music to have a good time talking with people (some of which they only see at weddings & funerals), even less so, video.
I know people are out there doing it, I just think it's a hard sell for many mobile gigs. I could be wrong.

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In my experience, what you have posted is not what I see.. but thats a whole nother set of threads..

What I do know, is people out there are doing it (many of them mobile DJ's, and many mobile wedding DJ's).. but I havent seen the corresponding talking and chatting about it..

BUT
your post kinda makes a point I was thinking about..

you have a "perception" that Video DJing is not working/happening much in the mobile industry and even less in the wedding industry..
I would suggest your "perception" is what it is because; very little opposing views have come out stating otherwise .. but I would state (with very little factual information besides my own experience), that perception is wrong (not completely wrong, but out of date, and not based on the current reality)

hippydog said:

In my experience, what you have posted is not what I see.. but thats a whole nother set of threads..
What I do know, is people out there are doing it (many of them mobile DJ's, and many mobile wedding DJ's).. but I havent seen the corresponding talking and chatting about it..BUT your post kinda makes a point I was thinking about..you have a "perception" that Video DJing is not working/happening much in the mobile industry and even less in the wedding industry.. I would suggest your "perception" is what it is because; very little opposing views have come out stating otherwise .. but I would state (with very little factual information besides my own experience), that perception is wrong (not completely wrong, but out of date, and not based on the current reality)

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Hip, you may indeed be right on. Remember, I'm not f/t (in the no other source of income sense of the phrase), I'm not one of the monster sized guys in the market, and right now, I'm not actively growing my business...so while I have an opinion and a perspective, it may not be coming from a similar enough place that would be of any real help to you and where you're coming from.

I know for me, there are other "up-sells" I prefer to add on first (and I know I sell them this way too) because the work/dollar value is just better. Maybe I need to change my system, but I/we hang our TV's from trussing. Stands, Trussing, Cables, Monitors, players, media...That's a lot of extra man-hours, and effort. If I can make that same money on up-sells that require less work, that's what I do. I know this may not be a politically correct thing to admit, but I'm being honest.

Most of the guys that VJ in my neck of the woods are targeting school prom Mitzvah events.

I know of two companies that do this in my neck of the woods.

hippydog said:

IE: when uplighting and photobooths first started gaining traction, I saw people talking about all over the place.. VDJ, is the complete opposite of what I have seen in the past for upcoming technologies/ideas..

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I think a big reason why you see so much more discussions about photo booths and uplighting is due to the much lower cost of entry, easy learning curve, how quick one can be up and running in those areas, and ROI.

I've thought about getting into music videos but the cost and ease of acquiring a decent, legal library is very daunting, plus the additional equipment costs, learning curve, setup and tear down makes me think, "uhm, nope".

We book our flat screens on almost every event.

However, music videos are just a part of the media we put on screen. We are mixing ambients, Real-time photos, real-time video camera, photo montage, custom graphics, chromakeyeyng, live feeds, text live, etc. along with the music videos.

The content of the videos being released make it very difficult to play a whole lot of music videos at an event. Even school events.

I think you're looking at Video DJing as something unique or discussion worthy. Most of the guys I know have been doing video for the better part of a decade, and many of the guys I know dj with pretty much all videos whether they're actually showing them or not. In fact, I really don't know any guys who aren't doing video.

You see a lot of discussion about Photo Booths because people make money with them. You see posts about lighting because people get paid to bring lighting. These things generate posts of interest from others who see people making more than they make to DJ in some instances from a PB or Up lighting.

Most DJs I know do video because they want to, not because they get paid to. I incorporated a 70" TV into my DJ booth a couple years ago, and I do video all the time. I'd never do video if I actually charged differently for it. It doesn't cost any more to do, so I just do it. Customers don't pay for it. They pay for the overall experience. I Explain that I'm coming loaded down with toys, and I will do what is necessary to properly pull the party off.

This is why I don't charge by the fixture for Up lighting. You pay the same price whether I use 10 or 40. it takes me 15 minutes to ring a room with lights. The customer is paying for the experience, not the fixture rental.

Like Johnny said, the content is the biggest hurdle at some events, but at others, not an issue.. you just have to play it by ear. I'll default to visualizations if I'm uncomfortable with the video track.

Cap said:

Big, large, huge in terms of time and money equals limited entry..

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i'm laughing cause as I was reading your response i was like "but its not that expen... oh.. right.. yup.. um.. sure.. VDJing takes up WAY more time and money then what it did 20 years ago.. yup.. thats it.." LOL
;-)

Steve Lynch said:

I think you're looking at Video DJing as something unique or discussion worthy. Most of the guys I know have been doing video for the better part of a decade, and many of the guys I know dj with pretty much all videos whether they're actually showing them or not. In fact, I really don't know any guys who aren't doing video.

You see a lot of discussion about Photo Booths because people make money with them. You see posts about lighting because people get paid to bring lighting. These things generate posts of interest from others who see people making more than they make to DJ in some instances from a PB or Up lighting.

Most DJs I know do video because they want to, not because they get paid to. I incorporated a 70" TV into my DJ booth a couple years ago, and I do video all the time. I'd never do video if I actually charged differently for it. It doesn't cost any more to do, so I just do it. Customers don't pay for it. They pay for the overall experience. I Explain that I'm coming loaded down with toys, and I will do what is necessary to properly pull the party off.

This is why I don't charge by the fixture for Up lighting. You pay the same price whether I use 10 or 40. it takes me 15 minutes to ring a room with lights. The customer is paying for the experience, not the fixture rental.

Like Johnny said, the content is the biggest hurdle at some events, but at others, not an issue.. you just have to play it by ear. I'll default to visualizations if I'm uncomfortable with the video track.

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I think you're looking at Video DJing as something unique or discussion worthy.

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ya.. I am..
I consider it a newer and expanded ARTFORM of DJing.. I'm not saying its super ground breaking, but there are cool and unique things that go with it that a person would not normally do or incorporate with "normal" audio only DJING..
so ya! i do consider it discussion worthy .. (maybe I'm just weird then??)

Most DJs I know do video because they want to, not because they get paid to.

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ok.. now THAT statement hits home.. never thought heavily about that, but looking back it could be the primary explanation..

there is no immediate "hey look at the gobs of money I made" statement made by anyone, becuase frankly, no one is making immediate huge "sales" on it.. so others are not "jumping on the bandwagon" like the other waves of "things" that happened (a-la-chocolate fountains, a-la-love-story, etc thingys)

hippydog said:

i'm laughing cause as I was reading your response i was like "but its not that expen... oh.. right.. yup.. um.. sure.. VDJing takes up WAY more time and money then what it did 20 years ago.. yup.. thats it.." LOL
;-)

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And were you doing mobile video 20 years ago? It was possible, but were you? Time & money still remain a roadblock, though admittedly now mostly time. And money also means profit ratio. It seems you've read my response literally and shortsightedly. My bad. Next time I'll leave as little room for laughter at my replies as possible.

that there is a huge time investment in finding materials, a huge time investment in learning editing and playback software, a large monetary investment in editing software, a large investment in monitors and mounting hardware, a need for larger space in transport and handling, and so forth. Big, large, huge in terms of time and money equals limited entry

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i'm laughing cause as I was reading your response i was like "but its not that expen... oh.. right.. yup.. um.. sure.. VDJing takes up WAY more time and money then what it did 20 years ago.. yup.. thats it.." LOL

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Cap said:

And were you doing mobile video 20 years ago? It was possible, but were you? Time & money still remain a roadblock, though admittedly now mostly time. And money also means profit ratio. It seems you've read my response literally and shortsightedly. My bad. Next time I'll leave as little room for laughter at my replies as possible.

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i wasnt laughing at YOU, I was laughing at my initial response that I immediately self censored.. IE: I pretty much did the same thing I was complaining about.. and I found it funny..

I wasnt doing video 20 years ago.. but i was doing weddings and using CD's, & cassettes, etc
There was no online downloading, no mobilebeat top 200's, no "radio edits" available..
I would buy the CD's, hopefully finding compilations so I didnt have to buy as many CD's, listen to all the songs, and then manually calculate the BPM, and make notes about the songs like "cue time" or "must play" , etc etc.. and if you needed a radio edit, you had to make your own (usually by recording it on cassette and simply "blanking out" the offensive parts)
"curation" of my music took many hours.. (enjoyably, not complaining, and in some ways I believe it made us better at knowing the music.. IE: the drag and drop method of nowadays is cheaper and faster but I think removes some of that "connection" the old school DJ's had with their music)
and P.S. The music collection outweighed some of the equipment! LOL

My point was.. (or should have been, if i took the time to say what I actually meant)

The "curation" of my music back then was a MUCH larger investment then my video collection today..
a.) editing software.. yes, I agree its needed.. but its not that bad.. there are pre-edited and legal sources available.. If not, most editing is really about fixing the few videos that differ heavily from the radio version.. and the editing software itself can be had for under $200.. and with the amount of ambient videos available, NOT every song needs to have a matching "official" video

b.) playback software: yes.. a large learning curve.. but for those who are already a digital DJ, the extra learning curve for video isnt that bad..

c.) hardware: if they are already digital DJ's, then technically the only extra hardware they need is a screen (either a TV, or projector style)..
THAT PART does take more room. and few bucks ;-) so ya.. the guys DJing out of their yugo are in the cold..

so..
"Big, large, huge"
honestly?
not really.. It depends on where a person started.. If they went from only using CD's (or using winamp) to computerized video mixing? oh, ya.. magor upgrade!
but for most of us in this biz? its not that bad..